Racist? Sexist?

[Zzzptm]

Now, the same artist *has* taken positions supportive of women...

[Zzzptm]

He has also portrayed Aretha Franklin favorably:

[Zzzptm]

Aaaaannnd, he's not necessarily a friend of the US' gun lobby...



I'd chalk up the Serena Williams thing to a lapse of judgment, assess the 15-yard penalty, and move on.

[Typhon]

I'm going to disagree strongly with the "never their fault" line.

We just finished week 1 of pro football here in the USA, and there were plenty of bad coaching decisions, bad play calls, bad reactions, bad everything. There are black head coaches that made bad calls, and nobody was saying that they should be replaced with a white coach... and nobody was saying that criticism of the black coaches was racially motivated. 30 years ago, that could very well have been a thing in the USA. It's not now.

It's a mental crutch to dismiss accusations of racism and sexism as being groundless, using always/never terms.

Just in case you think I missed it:  The last statement in the above comment may have been your disguised way of calling me a moron.  If it was, then just say it.  I promise not to go crying to a mod that I am being attacked.  But I assure you, I do not need a "mental crutch" to discuss anything.  I said what I said because of what I have witnessed for the past 20 odd years.  Whenever a crucial decision of some sort has gone against a black person, and they are asked if he or she believes that race had something to do with the decision, they always say yes.  That is automatic.

Your football example was dumb.  Nobody was fired or fined or suspended.  It was just people doing their job.  Some good, some not so good.

[Zzzptm]

No, Typhon, I'm not calling you a moron.

And my experience has been that racism does not automatically come up when a black person is asked if race had something to do with an adverse decision or experience. And even if it does come up, I've also seen it get walked back by the accuser, once he realized his error.

I'd say the football example wasn't dumb. When blacks first started playing at QB, I remember when they made mistakes hearing white people grumble that a white QB wouldn't have made the same errors. When blacks started coaching and made mistakes, there were whites that grumbled how a white coach wouldn't have made the same mistakes. Racism absolutely entered the picture in sports back then, and it will still do so today. Sports has been a very important part of the USA's civil rights history, not just in breaking the color barrier in various sports, but in athletes being able to use their prominence in sports to speak out about greater societal inequality.

I've seen racial determinants used in school discipline cases... both with teachers writing up black or Hispanic kids more often than whites as well as administrations coming back with directives that too many minority kids are getting written up and instituting quotas for disciplinary actions, both of which I found revolting. But had we not had the teachers going after the minorities, we wouldn't have had our hands tied as teachers in regards to sensible classroom discipline options.

As for that "always" in the public eye, I recall when, in the early 90s, the GOP went after Gangsta Rappers and called them all pretty much scum of the earth, scourges on our proud nation. The rappers didn't cry racism. They just started donating heavily to the GOP. Then the GOP stopped criticizing their supporters.

[Typhon]

^^^^^^
You're going off on a wild tangent again, which has nothing to do with what we were talking about.  Your original comment was referring to last weekend's play, not the entire history of sports.  Nothing happened last weekend that compares to the tantrum we saw from the crybaby.

The consensus of the Community = cartoon was not racist nor sexist.  Put this one in your loss column and move on.

[Zzzptm]

^^^^^^
You're going off on a wild tangent again, which has nothing to do with what we were talking about.  Your original comment was referring to last weekend's play, not the entire history of sports.  Nothing happened last weekend that compares to the tantrum we saw from the crybaby.

The consensus of the Community = cartoon was not racist nor sexist.  Put this one in your loss column and move on.

Wild tangent? I was pointing out the fallacy in saying that minorities are always playing the race card, as you asserted.

However, we can point out that those NFL players that protested during the national anthem received no penalty, even though the league could have moved to assess a penalty.

And while there's no question that Williams had a very public meltdown, it's also no question to me that the Australian cartoonist's portrayal of the same was inflammatory. For a bunch of white guys to see nothing racist or sexist in it... hardly conclusive, in my view. The conversation in this thread will eventually wind down, but I'll still maintain my view that the cartoonist made some unwise choices in his rendering of the incident and could have expressed his disdain without resorting to stock imagery reminiscent of Jim Crow and colonialist portrayals of Africans.

[BOGBLAST]

Is this cartoon sexist? Not a chance. Is it racist? Some people might see it that way, I don't. Now THIS is racist:

https://www.dailymotion.com/video/x6e7j0u

Skip to the 7:40 mark of this Popeye cartoon (if you wish) for a bonus history lesson.

[Jack the Stripper]

^^So these cartoons of Serena obviously went under the PC police's radar?

The Herald Sun(Melbourne's biggest daily newspaper) has dug their heels in on this one.

Today's front page   



On a side note I've actually met Mark Knight on a couple of occasions, he does the AFL premiers poster every year, a long standing tradition(equivalent to the Super Bowl champions) which is available straight after the Grand Final game at the ground. I've had some of my premiers posters personally signed by him when he's done signing sessions.

The guys actually recieved death threats over this and has had to have around the clock security at his house. Seriously how fucked up is that?

[BOGBLAST]

I hate this PC crap. I am not a racist and not a sexist but they're fuckin' cartoons for God sake. It's ok to caricature
white people but as soon as you draw anyone else you're a racist. 

[Charger]

I hate this PC crap. I am not a racist and not a sexist but they're fuckin' cartoons for God sake. It's ok to caricature
white people but as soon as you draw anyone else you're a racist. 

Could not agree with you more on this one!

The sad truth is that pretty much everyone else is protected under some stupid pc crap but a white male. You can call them racist, sexist, rapist, nazi what ever without any evidence or even a hint of truth and it always goes unnoticed and unpunished...I find that very disturbing indeed.

This is just another sad example of that.

And what is most funny (no not really funny but sad) it's usually not even the black's that are offended when something like this happens...like in this case it was that abnoxious writer JK Rowling...an insanely rich WHITE woman from the UK who started this whole discussion again...and I firmly believe that it has nothing to do with her finding it "racist" or whatnot she's just doing it to stir shit up and get her name out there since it's been a while from Harry Potter and she fears people might forget who she is...

[Typhon]

And while there's no question that Williams had a very public meltdown, it's also no question to me that the Australian cartoonist's portrayal of the same was inflammatory. For a bunch of white guys to see nothing racist or sexist in it... hardly conclusive, in my view. The conversation in this thread will eventually wind down, but I'll still maintain my view that the cartoonist made some unwise choices in his rendering of the incident and could have expressed his disdain without resorting to stock imagery reminiscent of Jim Crow and colonialist portrayals of Africans.

Will somebody please make a caricature of this guy?  Place him in the same pose as Serena, but looking like a spoiled brat kid stamping on his computer keyboard instead of a racquet, with the caption reading, "waah, waah, waah, all you guys are wrong and I'm right, waah, waah, waah."   

[Jack the Stripper]

^^He's doing nothing but offering his opinion, he's detailed on why he's formed that opinion and his sticking to it. Just because you disagree with it doesn't make him wrong or you right or vice versa

[Vyn]

The guys actually recieved death threats over this and has had to have around the clock security at his house. Seriously how fucked up is that?

That is...disturbing.

I can only imagine that those threat-makers have lives of peaches and cream such that the really bad shit they have to be burdened with, the kind of thing that makes them want to kill someone, consists of an editorial cartoon that mocks a professional tennis player channeling John McEnroe.

The most egregious issue I see with this entire fiasco is that Serena Williams succeeded in making that match all about her, and continues to do so. The stories should be about the winner. What a piss-poor display of sportsmanship. Serena Williams has won that tournament over 20 times, in spite of the (according to her) rampant sexism and racism she has to continually overcome. Serena lost to...oh...what's her name...oh yeah, Naomi Osaka. Who, as it has been related to me, is also a female of color. Who happens to be skinny and wears a blonde pony tail. As was depicted in the cartoon under discussion. But that somehow means the artist "whitened" her. And amazingly enough she managed to not get penalized by the same judge that penalized Serena. Is that judge just randomly sexist and racist? Did Naomi just get lucky?

Fuck those drooling neanderthals. Don't they realize that there is actual, real, racism and sexism in the world and that their constant yammering about what amounts to nonsense only obfuscates the real thing?

And now the artist of a cartoon is having his life threatened? Unreal. Are those people Muslims or something, and they think Serena is the prophet?

Congratulations Naomi! You won fair and square, and deserve your moment in the sun that sadly keeps getting overshadowed.

[Typhon]

^^He's doing nothing but offering his opinion, he's detailed on why he's formed that opinion and his sticking to it. Just because you disagree with it doesn't make him wrong or you right or vice versa

He implied that just because we are a group of white guys, that our conclusions are worthless.  If you don't see a problem with that narrow minded thinking, then that is your business.  But I have a problem with someone believing that I can't see straight just because I'm a white guy and the crybaby is black.