Ballads...Love 'em or Hate 'em?

[Jack the Stripper]

I really like Forever by KISS and I love Mama I'm Coming Home by Ozzy

Good shout with those two Thel, personally I think “I Still Love You” from Creatures of the Night is not only Kiss’s best ballad but one of the very best ballads from the genre. And Mama is one of Ozzy’s best for sure. He has one of the most emotive voices out there when it comes to ballads, how anyone can think otherwise or think he’s not suited to ballads is honestly beyond me.

[Vyn]

Some great selections - All stand-outs with unique "feel". Unlike a bunch of songs, al in the same vein. Not bad songs, and depending on the time and place, pretty good. But...Def Leppard's, "Bringin' on the Heartbreak". It has the same sort of lilting feel that Krokus later brought with, "Screaming in the Night." Or The Scorpions', "Still Loving You." Or April Wine's, "Just Between You and Me." Or 90% of Shooting Star's output. Same with Triumph. Or Boston. It's like one big song. Somewhat different base topics, but the same feel.

But, the women back in the day. Sitting around a park bench drinking beer and blasting Black Sabbath/Deep Purple/Cactus/etc and over time other dudes would start to accumulate around us. Good times. If we blasted something like Boston, women would accumulate. Even better times.

But, when my buddy had Rainbow blasting on his car stereo and a certain woman floated over to us - the best time. I ended up marrying her.

[Charger]

That's a nice story Vyn! Good music attracts good people.

Regarding Ozzy...the problem I've always had was bit of a two sider....A: most of Ozzy's ballads are extemely general and basic, ballads by the numbers type of songs.... and B: Ozzy's monotone delivery doesn't exactly scream emotion now does it...

Out of Ozzy's catalogue I would probably raise out 3 ballads that aren't bad. Goodbye To Romance, Road To Nowhere and although being very very very very cheesy, Mama I'm Coming Home which is probably his best vocal preformance on a ballad eventhough the lyrics are rather silly.


Ballads are very tricky songs...one might say that 9 out of 10 ballads are overly cheesy and actually lack the emotion they are trying to convey. Also the fact that some singers have emotion in their voice and others simply don't. And yes that is also I believe a subjective view...others might find emotion in something other's don't.

I've always found it odd why certain bands think that it's an absolute must to have a ballad on each album...as more often than not it just ends up being a skip-a-doo song.

[Ted Sallis]

There are two ballads I'd like to mention:

Fade to Black - Metallica: their 1st and best ballad in my view.  Putting a song like this on their 2nd album was seen as a bold move and it indicated just how much they were willing to venture into new musical territory and embrace change.

Hard Hearted Alice - Alice Cooper: an amazing introspective song about the trials of success, it quite aptly was inspired by the Group having reached the pinnacle of their popularity earlier that year (1973).

I may add more shortly.

Ted

[KiloDeltaCharlie]

I'll start with a few that came to mind. I won;t duplicate what others have included.


Emerson, Lake and Palmer - Still... You Turn Me On

The Stranglers - Princess of the Street. A slow bluesy song

Yes - Turn of the Century

New Model Army - Someone Like Jesus


I will almost certainly add to this list!

[Jack the Stripper]

That's a nice story Vyn! Good music attracts good people.

Regarding Ozzy...the problem I've always had was bit of a two sider....A: most of Ozzy's ballads are extemely general and basic, ballads by the numbers type of songs.... and B: Ozzy's monotone delivery doesn't exactly scream emotion now does it...

Out of Ozzy's catalogue I would probably raise out 3 ballads that aren't bad. Goodbye To Romance, Road To Nowhere and although being very very very very cheesy, Mama I'm Coming Home which is probably his best vocal preformance on a ballad eventhough the lyrics are rather silly.


Ballads are very tricky songs...one might say that 9 out of 10 ballads are overly cheesy and actually lack the emotion they are trying to convey. Also the fact that some singers have emotion in their voice and others simply don't. And yes that is also I believe a subjective view...others might find emotion in something other's don't.

I've always found it odd why certain bands think that it's an absolute must to have a ballad on each album...as more often than not it just ends up being a skip-a-doo song.

I agree that some of Ozzy’s ballads are overly sappy but he is definitely not a monotone singer. Whilst you may not like She’s Gone for its sappiness that song is very heartfelt and dripping with emotion. Where’s to me, Blaze Bayley is the very definition of a monotone singer, which is why I never liked him in Maiden, where’s Ripper isn’t a monotone singer but it’s his bland vocal melodies that don’t do it for me. Besides a couple of songs from Demolition, nothing sticks or is hooky enough to remember or make you wanna singalong to him.

[Charger]

As I said subjective....but most people would very much disagree with you on most of that. Ozzy is one of the if not even THE most monotone singer in history. And that's not all a bad thing, he makes it work for most stuff but emotion isn't one of them...for emotion you need to have variety in your voice and in your delivery... Ozzy just has none of that...

But this isn't really about that, it's about good and bad ballads...

[Zzzptm]

DON'T STOP

BELIEEEEEEVIN'

[Charger]

EDIT:

Nah forget it.

I'm not gonna get sucked into this shit again. I know Jack hates my guts and just wants to keep kicking me every chance he gets but now I'm just gonna be the bigger man and let this out of topic nonsense go.

Cleaned up the topic a bit so we can carry on talking about ballads.

[Charger]

So back on track.

I'll start with a few that came to mind. I won;t duplicate what others have included.


Emerson, Lake and Palmer - Still... You Turn Me On

The Stranglers - Princess of the Street. A slow bluesy song

Yes - Turn of the Century

New Model Army - Someone Like Jesus


I will almost certainly add to this list!

I have to honestly say I have never heard any of these songs...know very little about the bands either...might have to go to the youtube and check some of these out.

[Charger]

I did notice one thing that I totally forgot to mention after my list.

I was supposed to talk a bit about Motörhead. So I might as well do so now.

They've also done some good ballad-type songs over the years.
Top one ofcourse being Whorehouse Blues which is a tongue in cheek type song for sure and it's loads of fun. Always loved that song.

Another one worth mentioning I'd say is Love Me Forever. Although I think the duet with Lemmy and Doro is the ultimate version.

If you haven't heard it I'd highly recommend checking it out.

Here's a great live version:

Till The End from Bad Magic also ended up being a bit prophetic and as such deserves to be mentioned.

I think Whorehouse Blues could have made it on the list but there's very little chance of me putting on a top 10 list without including Black Sabbath! 

[Zzzptm]

Lemmy and Doro do a fantastic number there, no question.

And I will admit I liked "More Than Words" from Extreme when it came out. Of all the power ballads, it found a way to stand out. Don't know why it did for me, but it did.

[Zzzptm]

I have to come back to soul ballads - there's even the sub-genre of "quiet storm" recordings for that niche. Soul emerged from emotional and expressive gospel singing, so it lends itself very well to emotional and expressive love ballads. The typical instrumentation, song structure, vocal stylizations, all work so well for a strong ballad. Country and Folk also have a strong musical vocabulary for ballads.

Then there's metal.

The whole point of metal is a harder, more aggressive sound. Often, the lyrics that go best with metal are about driving fast, casual sex, nuclear war, and satanic rituals. Not really the stuff of proper love ballads, right?

The drop back to acoustic arrangements with an electric guitar solo makes many of those so-called "power ballads" more of a country/folk song with metal guitar solo than a metal song with acoustic guitars.

Can a song stay properly metal and still be a ballad? Or does the act of singing a ballad take the metal edge off of things and then we have a country/folk song played very loudly?

[Vyn]

Can a song stay properly metal and still be a ballad? Or does the act of singing a ballad take the metal edge off of things and then we have a country/folk song played very loudly?

I think there are intelligent arguments that can be made both for and against it. And then, just plain personal opinion tossed in to make it impossible to have one, "officially correct," classification. Whatever, "official," means.

But, that's not a copout on my part - just wanted to open with what I think about it objectively. Personally, I think it's possible.

As you stated, metal has a certain sound. And I think that a ballad, which also has a certain sound, is at odds with some of the fundamental characteristics of a metal song. But not enough to make them mutually exclusive!

A heavy metal group playing a ballad? For sure. Of course guitar tone and volume level alone don't make a song metal or ballad. Take Judas Priest's BTROD - I call it a ballad, Charger does not. Both takes make sense to me. But the track, residing within the storied album "Stained Class," captures the emotional depth and complexity that can be found within the metal genre as a whole. Laced with poignant lyrics, the song delves into themes of despair, isolation, and the struggle for inner freedom. Musically, it juxtaposes the somber melodies of a ballad with the raw power of heavy metal, utilizing an evocative blend of Rob Halford's hauntingly melodic vocals, and the twin guitar onslaught of Glenn Tipton and K.K. Downing. This synergy results in a dynamic ebb and flow, with moments of gentle introspection escalating into soaring crescendos of intense sonic energy. "Beyond the Realms of Death" showcases Judas Priest's ability to harness the emotional spectrum of the human experience and encapsulate it within the thunderous realm of heavy metal.

What am I trying to say here? That it could be either, and they're both not wrong. LOL And I think the same could be applied to other songs as well.

[Zzzptm]

Giving a spin to BTROD now... listening carefully and, yes, it's that metal in the tune. The whole model is something we see again in Watch the Children Pray from Metal Church - but neither are romantic in nature, so does the metal ballad lend itself to the older, broader definition of a storytelling sort of song and not necessarily a romantic topic?

Stained Class came out in 1978, early in the history of metal, and that track is something I'd call a definitive template. Digging back 5 years, I get Uriah Heep's Circle of Hands, which is one of those songs that always gets me, right in the heart.

Instead of acoustic guitar, it's the organ that provides the lighter-touch instrumentation in the verses, lending a more spiritual element to the piece. The key elements of a metal/power ballad are all there, so I see this as much a template for future work as Priest's track. Makes ya want to get out the lighter and wave it in the air, for sure!

That same year, 1973, saw the release of Pronounced Lynyrd Skynyrd, which has Tuesday's Gone, Simple Man, and Freebird. While not metal, they have hard rock elements, particularly Simple Man and Freebird. The band does not go for acoustic, but does achieve a dynamic difference between verses and chorus to bring in that ballad-y emotional effect.

In 1982, we get a great ballad from Whitesnake, the original "Here I Go Again" from Sinners & Saints. Jon Lord takes a page from Ken Hensley with the organ background to Coverdale's vocals, and then the guitars strum a little before we have the swing-your-mug-along chorus that bangs out the chords for us all. It's not overdone or overproduced like the later version, and is a favorite of mine.