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ROCK AND ROLL! => Black Sabbath => The Ozzy Years => Topic started by: Zzzptm on September 09, 2020, 07:55:58 AM
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I'll start this by saying that up until now, I've not been a fan of the first album. But I'm wondering how much of that is based on what's actually on that album or what happens to those songs when done live. Like what happened with "Snowblind", where I let the over-the-top stuff done live affect my appreciation of the studio version. In the case of Black Sabbath and N.I.B., I blame Dio. I love most of how Dio interprets work done by other vocalists, but not when it comes to Ozzy-era material. He gets way too growly, and it doesn't work for that material, not for me.
So I want to do the first album. I want to come in fresh and give it a proper listen for the first time in a long time. No guarantees on any outcomes. I've got meetings for the next two hours, but I should have enough break after that to do a solid listen to the title track.
Feel free to cuss and discuss the track in the meantime - if there's something special you find about it, let me know and I'll see if I can hear the same thing, as well.
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Well I have to disagree on one point though right away. I've always found Ronnie's version of NIB to be the ultimate one. He elevates that song to a whole new level...and that's a feat as it's on a pretty damn high level to begin with!
I think I'll put this album on now as well for my workout music today. Just to get a fresh listen as it has been a while.
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I’m with you Z as I think as are most fans.The original era songs just didn’t gel with Ronnie. They didn’t have the same vibe, portray the same emotion or convey the message of the song like Ozzy did or was originally intended, that’s not a knock on Ronnie, it’s the same for most singers that have tried to sing Ozzy songs.
I liken it to singers trying to sing Roger Waters Pink Floyd songs, they can have all the technical singing abilities over Waters but can’t bring the character or portray the message of the song like he did which is vitally important in giving the song authenticity.
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The title track is probably the most important song in the history of heavy metal. Personally, I think there are better songs on the album and the guys went on to do much better albums.
I get why the song Black Sabbath is so important, if I had been there when it was released I would probably love it more, and I do quite like it, but it drags a little at the start and the lyrics are a little weak, but once the song speeds up it's great.
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Taking that plunge...
Opening riffs - DEFINITELY some of the heaviest, doomiest sounds of the day, if not THE heaviest/doomiest. The lyrics... well, let's just say that Geezer really matured a LOT as a lyricist by the time SBS rolled out. :smug:
But Ozzy's best moments are on his fills, the "OH NO PLEASE GOD HELP ME" is iconic. Nevermind some of the cheeze from the main verses - Ozzy sells it with his screaming pleas.
Instrumentally, this is proof that less is way more when you want to set up a mood. 3 chords, sparse lines, echoing drumbeats - that was real fun to take in like that.
The fast part is fast, and the band keeps it simple enough to be effective. I can hear why this is a concert staple - only one track per instrument so what you hear here is what you get live. No disappointment when there's but the one guitar trying to do the work of 8 in the studio YEAH I'M LOOKING AT *YOU* JIMMY PAGE!!!
This is not a complicated piece. Start slow and doomy, end fast and panicked. Honestly, this is like musical home cooking. Coming back to the original after this time, well, I have a new appreciation for it. There's no real nuance to discover - it is what it is, and it's metal the way Mom used to make it, so to speak. I'm still wanting to taste SBS, but I'm finding this track to be overall quite satisfying and I'm looking forward to The Wizard coming up next.
This is definitely where Billy's argument about a lead singer being better *because* he's not all spit and polish holds true.
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Zzzptm's comments cover the self-titled tune very well. I just have a couple of other comments.
The title track is probably the most important song in the history of heavy metal.
:yes:
I get why the song Black Sabbath is so important, if I had been there when it was released I would probably love it more,
Well, I was 12 years old in 1970, not really a big music fan, just heard what ever the radio stations played. But when I heard Black Sabbath, it was the first time I was stopped in my tracks and said, "now who the heck is this?" :zomg:
The appropriately self-titled very first song, to me, is the band saying, "This is who we are, and if you don't like it, then don't listen." >:D
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I first heard that song on my record player after I thought I was getting Paranoid (being a kid and not knowing anything, I think I told that story before).
My initial reaction was along the lines of WTF!?
I remember calling some friends (one at a time, rotary phone, cuz, you know, no group chat at the time) just to come over and hear it. I didn't listen to anything but the title track for a couple of days. Like Z pointed out, it is simple, super heavy without production knobbing, and it remains unlike anything else out there.
I did not have these thoughts at the time, but looking back...in the midst of the Vietnam War and the attendant social upheaval in the US, the hippies were listening to "Volunteers" and Black Sabbath rolled up with a song that conveyed the "shit-your-drawers" fear that the world was changing beyond your control, and not for the better.
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^^Awesome Vyn.
I was introduced to it via Ozzy’s Speak of the Devil album in late 82. I was 11 at the time and it was the eeriest, darkest, and most atmospheric songs I’d ever heard and still is to this day. Can only imagine what it would’ve been like hearing it for the time in 1970. Groundbreaking song and always a highlight of any original era Sabbath live show.
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The title track was without a doubt the song that started everything heavy and doomy. And it was something that was completely new at the time...
I don't know if there's much to be said that hasn't already been said.
As an album opener this is one of those few slower songs that actually work and work well...big thanks to the intro which adds yet another layer of mystique to the track.
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Time for "The Wizard"...
This one I have always had fun with, that harmonica intro does it for me every time. Again, direct riffage backed up with some great technical drumming from Bill Ward.
Best blues-rock song about a wizard that I know of. :D
And that's what this is, a straight-up blues number with the volume cranked up. Led Zeppelin was already doing this, but Black Sabbath wrote their *own* lyrics! :smug: Iommi's solo is almost buried in the mix, though, would have liked it to be more prominent. And when the criticism is basically, "wish I could hear more", that's a good place to be.
But, yeah, Bill's drumming is the star of this show. You can tell the guy liked Buddy Rich and didn't want to be just a 4/4 metronome when he played.
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I like The Wizard, but it took years for me to really appreciate it. I think I felt it was a little silly and throw-away, almost filler even. But over the years I've really become a fan, I love the harmonica on it.
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Yup Bill is the star of the show here as is Ozzy’s harmonica. Great track to follow Black Sabbath and another set staple live gem.
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The Wizard is without a doubt one of my favourites. The riff is brilliant. This is one of those examples again where Ozzy's vocal melody follows the riff quite faithfully and it works great.
The harmonica part is simple but great.
And as said Bill's drumming is flawless here, but one thing that hasn't been mentioned is Geezer's bass work which I think is really great. He plays the bass almost like rythm guitar here.
The lyrics are great too...based on Gandalf I believe. Although some think the wizard is a code for a drug dealer but I find that bit far fetched to be honest. Wizard is a wizard simple as that.
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Yeah, this is a very early sort of D&D song. Even before the game was released! :D Heck there were people who thought "Smoke on the Water" was a kind of hashish hookah reference. :doh:
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So is the next song "Wasp / Behind the Wall of Sleep / Bassically / N.I.B" ? Or do we need to break each one out separately? :D
I'll take them as a suite, as they were played. I'm reading that the recording was done in 12 hours, pretty much one shot, straight through. Everything was pretty much recorded live, with Ozzy singing in a separate booth. Then they drove off to play a gig in Switzerland.
So does this count as Sabbath's first live album? Mmmmmmmmmmmaybeeeeeee....
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I'm going to take them the way they were intended as separate songs Wasp/Behind the Wall of Sleep and Basically/NIB. It was only the North American market where they treated them as one song for no readily apparent reason! ;)
W/BtWoS I think is where the album hits it's high water mark. Wasp is one of my all time favourite intros to a song, And the song itself is great, my second favouriteon the album, love it.
B/NIB, starts with the sort of bass solo that I think only an early 70s rock band could get away with. It works fine but maybe better production could have made it even better. NIB is my favourite off the album, and it's possibly still a an all time top 10 Sabbath track for me.
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^ as evidenced in your sig. :smug:
I'm in the USA, so I have to take them as one big song, 'cos the record company told me to. :)
The lyrics in "Beyond the Wall of Sleep" have always sounded incomprehensible to me. I like them, but they may as well be a foreign language. Also, the phrasing of the lyrics is off. It's like they wrote a poem and set it to music without realizing that's not quite how lyrics work.
NIB really drives the point home with the bass and guitar essentially playing the same line. I read just now that Geezer came to the bass by way of the guitar, so that directly influenced how he played it very much as a guitar.
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Sorry I'm late with The Wizard review. Was out of commission yesterday. :squint:
The Wizard is one of my Top 5 Sabbath songs. I can only describe the harmonica sound as sinister. As soon as it starts, I feel I'm in a Hammer Horror movie, with the scene as shown on the album cover. As others have already stated, all band members show their special skills in this one, but it is Ozzy's harmonica that propels this tune over the top for me. As unique a song as one could get. :abbath:
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^ That Hammer Horror reference is spot on. This is a raw album, not concerned with special effects as much as it is with getting a chill up your spine as effectively as possible with the talent and resources at hand.
And, apologies to Charger... but Dio's live versions strike me the same way as modern musical updates of older films do... Little Shop of Horrors and Hairspray were fine enough on their own, so why did they have to get over-the-top treatment? I like Dio doing Dio best, and this re-listen is proving that, along with what I've been missing.
Kind of like not eating something you used to like because someone else made it the wrong way... go back to the original prep, should still be good there.
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Such a great variation of songs on the debut as were all their 70’s albums but the balls and foresight to put bass solo on an album back then let alone your debut was extraordinary. N.I.B. is one of Sabbaths finest cuts and features one of my favourite Tony solos from his early works.
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Behind The Wall Of Sleep (inspired by HP Lovecrafts work by the way) is a great little tune. Starts off fast then slows down to the verse which adds nice contrast. The riff is simple but groovy, not super heavy but groovy.
That seamlessly goes into one of Sabbath's biggest classics N.I.B. With it's monster bass solo intro which has to be one of the best bass solo intros EVER.
N.I.B. is lyrically brilliant and the main riff is without a doubt one of Tony's most iconic ones. And as Jack mentioned the soloing is rather brilliant too.
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^^^^^^
Pretty much says it all. :pub:
There is not even 1 bad note throughout this entire stretch, or on the entire album, for that matter. That's what makes a 10 a 10.
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After NIB I'm curious if Zs will go with Wicked World or Evil Woman?
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Wicked World. That's what it says on *my* track listing here in the USA. "Evil Woman" is an ultra-rare collectible that you have to go to listening parties to hear. :smug:
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Wicked World. That's what it says on *my* track listing here in the USA. "Evil Woman" is an ultra-rare collectible that you have to go to listening parties to hear. :smug:
I guess you don't have the Castle remasters then...That is my version...the one I've had since day one and that's the track list bible for me and it goes like this:
Black Sabbath
The Wizard
Behind The Wall Of Sleep
N.I.B.
Evil Woman
Sleeping Village
The Warning
Wicked World
;D
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I do have Wicked World, it's on the Black Box import from the USA I bought when it first came out. But I tend to listen to the Deluxe Edition which came out about 10 years ago and is the UK version.
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Wicked World. That's what it says on *my* track listing here in the USA. "Evil Woman" is an ultra-rare collectible that you have to go to listening parties to hear. :smug:
I guess you don't have the Castle remasters then...That is my version...the one I've had since day one and that's the track list bible for me and it goes like this:
Black Sabbath
The Wizard
Behind The Wall Of Sleep
N.I.B.
Evil Woman
Sleeping Village
The Warning
Wicked World
;D
??? Warning is the closer.
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^^^Yep, my original UK vinyl pressing reads
Side 2
Evil Woman, Don’t Play Your Games With Me
Sleeping Village
Warning
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??? Warning is the closer.
Nope not for me it ain't!
(https://boxmail.biz/constructor/img/203437.jpg)
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Might I suggest we do Wicked World next, THEN Evil Woman so that Warning can be the rightful last track!
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Might I suggest we do Wicked World next, THEN Evil Woman so that Warning can be the rightful last track!
I second that motion.
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I quite enjoy Wicked World, it is probably the Sabbath song I know the least -- in much the same way as Evil Woman is probably less well known to many in the North American community.
There's not much more I can say except I really need to buy a turntable and listen to the 19minute version on Live At Last... or maybe I could actually buy the CD, I suppose it might be cheaper!!
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The first time I heard “Wicked World“ was on an Australian/NZ only Black Sabbath compilation called “The Best - The Ultimate in Heavy Metal” that came out in 1983 which happened to be the first Sabbath album I got of original recordings. For a couple of years there when I was first getting into Sabbath I wondered where this great song had come from as it wasn’t on any of the official Ozzy era releases.
I’ve always loved the song though, so much so it was the 2nd Black Sabbath song I ever learnt on guitar behind Iron Man. I remember taking a tape of the song to one of my lessons and getting my teacher to work the song out for me. Strangely though, I’ve always felt it sounded a bit out of place on the debut, not just because it wasn’t on the original press or the actual song itself but the production just sounded a bit different to the other songs. Maybe the fact Tony used a Stratocaster and not the SG on it and Ozzy voice sounds like there’s a filter on it or something might of had me thinking that way. Great song though and taken to an even greater level live.
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I have always liked the opening that features the Tony Iommi Jazz Trio before Black Sabbath takes over. :smug:
I kid, but that's pretty much what it is. It's a very enjoyable, jazzy intro before the song turns to heavy blues for the main portion.
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I also enjoy Wicked World very much. It continues the overall eerie vibe of the album.
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Like I've always said Wicked World is one of my favourites...the intro riff, Tony's solo guitar solo is brilliant (and something I wish he would have done on later albums as well) and Bill's drumming is top notch too.
I like how the song mixes heavy with jazzy vibes perfectly.
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Listening to it today, I had to follow up with some Peter Green's Fleetwood Mac. Not as heavy, but still very much in that distorted blues vein that this song is in. Green has a great character in his voice, just like Ozzy has that character in his.
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^^Fair comparison and always worth making a point about the character Ozzy brought to the songs.
Shall we move onto the cover “Evil Woman, don’t play your games with me“?
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I'll kick off with Evil Woman
It has that feeling of "filler" all over it. It's an okay song, but I don't think they really put their heart and soul into it. I'm not familiar with the original but if this is an improvement I would be surprised!
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I like Evil Woman, like the original Crow song as well. Adds a good variation to the album with its uptempo feel. Strange song for them to cover though, especially given the original was already made famous and got to #19 on the billboard charts less than a year before, but it seems it was quite normal for bands back then to cover songs that similarly weren’t that old.
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If memory serves me the story goes the band didn't want to cover the song at all but the manager Jim Simpson wanted a single and it was a custom in the UK at the time for bands to record cover versions of big US hits before they made it big in the UK. So the band "had to" do the song. It was also recorded in a completely seperate session.
It's something of a throw away track. It doesn't really fit the mood of the album at all. Bit on the "happy" side in comparison to the rest of the songs.
Ironically it made no impact on the single charts either.
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^^^^^^
Precisely what I heard and agree. I, personally, am glad it is not on the album here in the states. The band did not write it, and it doesn't belong. I do listen to the song separately from the album in my mix CDs. I'm pleased with how it sounds there.
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"Evil Woman" goes great with Deep Purple's "Black Night". Seriously. Similar riffs, similar blues-driven verses with a brief singalong chorus. And it sounds like Tony used a Fender for at least one of the guitars tracked on the single.
Totally a contractual obligation sort of recording.
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Shall we?
Red sun rising in the sky
Sleeping village, cock’rel’s cry
Soft breeze blowing in the trees
Peace of mind, feel at ease
Somewhat downcast start with Tony’s haunting chords and Ozzy’s sombre vocals while the Jews harp does its thing in the background, it then picks up the mood when Bill joins the fray before launching into a cool jazzy jam, only then to bring the mood back again to then perfectly transition into “Warning“.
It’s cool, I like it, no, actually I love it...
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I too quite like Sleeping Village/A Bit of Finger, but it's the jazzy jam I really like. The slow start I feel doesn't really fit with the rest of the track (or vice versa!)
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Sleeping Village is without a doubt one of the more oddball songs in Sabbath's catalogue but I absolutely love it. The slow intro, the haunting vocals from Ozzy, the whole atmosphere is stellar.
And then when it speeds up into a hard rocky jazz-jam it just gets better and better.
Sleeping Village is something of Sabbath's Lazy...an instrumental with lyrics.
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Well said, Charger. :) Even better said, Jack. ;)
@KDC: It's a journey, buddy. Just let the Sabs take you where they wish. :partay:
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I'm going to move on to Warning... and then hide somewhere safe! ;)
This is a track of two parts. There's the song part and there's the extending guitar solo... I absolutely love the song part, musically and lyrically it's absolutely perfect...
... however, I've never really liked the guitar solo and these days I just skip it.
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:kramer:
The guitar solo part is what makes that song so awesome...the track itself (being a cover and all, although bit more fitting for Sabbath than Evil Woman was) isn't anything spectacular but once Tony gets soloing the song just elevates to another level!
That song all in all was so early 70s that you can't really get much more early 70s than that. And that's all positive too I might add. The extended jam section, played live in the studio...it has it all.
I remember reading that the original version of the Warning clocked in at over 15 or was it nearly 20 minutes long..I'd love to hear that!
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Another eerie song that perfectly fits the mood of the album. Great cover which Sabbath made their own with the long extended jam and Tony’s stand alone solo. Love the lyrics but why oh why did Ozzy change the line “I was warned about you baby” to “I was born without you baby”? Once I realised this I couldn’t unrealise it, the former makes much more sense.
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Another eerie song that perfectly fits the mood of the album. Great cover which Sabbath made their own with the long extended jam and Tony’s stand alone solo. Love the lyrics but why oh why did Ozzy change the line “I was warned about you baby” to “I was born without you baby”? Once I realised this I couldn’t unrealise it, the former makes much more sense.
Yeah, that's the hazard of doing it all in one take... :smug:
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Gonna compare and contrast:
I do prefer the Black Sabbath version for one reason: it doesn't have the big pauses that the ADR version has. I like the smoother flow in the BS version. That being said, I do enjoy both. Worthy of note is how the bass is turned way up on both. Listening to just about anything Jack Bruce played bass on, same thing.
So this gets me to ask, what was the secret sauce in Black Sabbath that made it the band that people all point back at and not Cream? Because both ADR and BS were compared to Cream, along with Zeppelin and Deep Purple. They and a bunch of other bands were all a bunch of kids playing blues at a loud volume with drummers playing Buddy Rich fills in between 4/4 beats.
The band definitely worked well together - no question of that at all, especially on the first 6 albums. But so do a bunch of other bands. Geezer and Bill were a great rhythm section, but so were Overend Watts and Buffin in Mott the Hoople. Ozzy's vocals are distinct, but so were those of a lot of other vocalists. If Rod Stewart had been singing vocals, we'd be all about Rod v Dio and stuff.
I think it comes back to Iommi's guitar style, when all is said and done. His guitar sound is what made the band.
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And now for the gratuitous and unnecessary ranking of the songs:
1. N.I.B.
2. Behind the Wall of Sleep
3= Black Sabbath
3= The Wizard
5. Warning
6. Wicked World
7. A Bit of Finger
8. Evil Woman
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I'll play.
1. Wicked World
2. N.I.B. (Especially the live version with Ronnie! Up yours haters! ;D )
3. The Wizard
4. Black Sabbath
5. The Warning
6. Sleeping Village
7. Behind The Wall Of Sleep
And on another day the order of any of those songs could be totally different.
This would be the only constant:
8. Evil Woman
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Overall, the album remains my least-liked of the first six. I like it more than I used to, but I still like the others more. The rawness works on NIB and The Wizard and Black Sabbath. It detracts on side two, where the songs could have been tightened up more. If "The Warning" left out the massive solo and the solo itself were a separate instrumental, I would have been able to get into it all much better.
My fave track is and has been The Wizard.
Next up is Wicked World (Featuring the Tony Iommi Jazz Trio)
Warning is too similar to Wicked World, so I'm going to put it fourth, after the third-place tie with Black Sabbath and NIB.
The rest is stuff that kinda blends into the other tracks on the LP.
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Inserting my final rating of the albums for completion's sake.
Black Sabbath - 10/10
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I'll rate these too then now...
Black Sabbath:
* * * * ½
Evil Woman cost that half a star.
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I'll rate these too then now...
You mean for completion's sake? :))
Black Sabbath:
* * * * ½
Evil Woman cost that half a star.
There is no Evil Woman on mine.
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I'll rate these too then now...
You mean for completion's sake? :))
Indeed! :D
Black Sabbath:
* * * * ½
Evil Woman cost that half a star.
There is no Evil Woman on mine.
Well then I understand why you gave it a full rating! ;D
Yeah Evil Woman being a cover of a US band ofcourse was not included on the US version...
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Groundbreaking album. First heard this at age 10. Needless to say I was hooked. I think MY favorite song is Warning. What I like best is the part just before Tony's stand alone solo. You've got the guitar on one side and the bass on the other. As a kid I used to turn the balance to the bass side and groove on Geezer's bass. :geezer: