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ROCK AND ROLL! => All Them Other Guys => Topic started by: Charger on February 10, 2024, 05:53:15 AM
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So now that I've fully immersed myself in Hell, Fire And Damnation what other albums should I most certainly be looking at?
A facebook buddy already recommended Crusader.
Any other must haves?
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First album - it's ok. Cover art indicates a young band still finding its way and that's the sound of the album. They're loud, but don't yet know where to focus.
Wheels of Steel - The beginning of the golden years for Saxon. Great tracks on this one, they decided to be metal and that's what works.
Strong Arm of the Law - two different track listings, I prefer the US one. Not just because I grew up with it but because Dallas 1PM is SUCH A GREAT OPENING TRACK. It's a Highway Star for conspiracy theories. :)
Denim and Leather - Got goosebumps as I typed the title because I started to sing the title track, a true anthem of metal fans being awesome. Opening track "Princess of the Night" is Highway Star for freight trains. :D
The Eagle Has Landed - first live album, it's pretty dang good. Not a must-have, but sure is nice to have.
Power & the Glory - My word, but that opening riff tears my face off every time! The original US version doesn't have Midas Touch, but instead a new version of Suzie Hold On and a slightly rearranged track order. I think Denim and Leather is stronger than this one, but this is definitely a monster album. Fourth studio album in a proud line of winners.
Crusader - another one with a jumbled-up US track listing that put Sailing to America as the opening track and I prefer it that way, as it is one of my fave Saxon anthems. A sort of Highway Star for wooden ships and Pilgrims. :yes: I think some of the songs dropped off in metallic-ness, and I didn't enjoy it as much as the previous four.
What follows starting with Innocence is No Excuse is a stretch of commercial 80s "hey let's do like what Whitesnake just did" metal that got me to check out after 2 albums, which means I missed hearing their cover of Christoper Cross' "Ride Like the Wind". I'm playing that now, and, yeah, it's no longer NWOBHM but the Commercial Wave of Eighties Hair Metal. Stopped it halfway thruough because enough was enough. But this begins where I can't speak to their product, as I'd also checked out as a listener by then.
So now I'm going to go back and find where they got good again, knowing well that they can make a misstep. Last year's collection of covers sounded dreadful and it was hearing Biff Byford sounding great with Girlschool that gave me hope for this year's release - that they are touring with Uriah Heep was another good sign.
Playing a little from Solid Ball of Rock and while it's no Denim and Leather, I think it's something of a return to form, or at least a start of that journey back.
Their 2011 release, Call to Arms, is amazing. I picked that one out of curiosity and got blown away, so there is metal ore to mine in those Saxon veins.
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I find Saxon at their best when they're telling a tale of historical awe in their lyrics. Be it battle or industry or speculative history, those are the lyrics that get me and get me good. Equally good are their songs praising their fans, metal in general, and operating some sort of vehicle with speed and precision. :) When they're good, I get emotionally stirred and find myself in the middle of the action of the song. I'm playing "English Man of War" now from their Lionheart album and HELL YES this is one of those great Saxon tracks that I love, even if it's the first time for me to hear it.
Sampling stuff from albums I haven't spun before, I can definitely say that they got good again somewhere between 1990 and 2010. :D That's a 20-year span, I know, but I look forward to the journey and doing a review on their body of work. Not having big label pressures definitely helped and getting established and comfortable meant that they could do what they were comfortable with, and do it well.
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My recommendations:
Wheels of Steel
Strong Arm of the Law
Denim and Leather
The Eagle Has Landed
Power & the Glory
There's also a compilation album, Diamonds & Nuggets which contains a few live tracks and many original takes of their classic songs, alternative versions of their songs, etc. There is also an SOB (pre-Saxon Group) song and a Coast (another pre-Saxon Group) song included. The recordings on the release go as far back as 1972.
Ted
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Just played through Carpe Diem from 2022. It is a great album, confirmed! Didn't have any wincing or cringing - in fact, quite the opposite. Easy to get into and bang one's head along with. Strong all the way through - my fave track was Age of Steam, but that could be because I am playing Victoria 3 right now.
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I have now also played through Thunderbolt and Battering Ram. I want to go back again to these, as I was doing other stuff while listening and couldn't focus entirely on the music enough to where I'd be able to rank them overall. That being said, they rocked hard and I at no point thought about switching them off, skipping songs, or wondering if I'd hit the bad patch of Saxon. I liked Battering Ram better than Thunderbolt, but I also liked Thunderbolt quite a bit.
Thunderbolt got a mixed bag because I wasn't totally thrilled with the Nosferatu song but I totally rocked out to their tribute to Lemmy and Motorhead, "They Played Rock and Roll." FANTASTIC banger of a track, that one.
The first Inspirations album was better than the second, but it's going to be down to personal tastes whether or not you want to hear Saxon's version of "Paperback Writer" or not. As for the live albums, I passed over those in order to focus on the studio material.
That leaves just Sacrifice in between what I listened to yesterday and Call to Arms, which I checked out earlier and absolutely loved. The journey continues... :D
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Power and the Glory is one of the greatest nwobhm albums period
Their newer albums are pretty good too especially the last 5 or 6 releases
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I never really got into them, but I liked some of their earlier stuff like Wheels of Steel and 747 (Strangers in the Night). I bought a compilation of theirs in the late 80s but never felt the need to explore further.
Yes, I may well be missing out.
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Thank you guys for the input! I think I have a pretty good idea where to go next! The early 80s albums! Starting with Power And The Glory and work my way onwards from there!
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Thank you guys for the input! I think I have a pretty good idea where to go next! The early 80s albums! Starting with Power And The Glory and work my way onwards from there!
Be sure that you work *backwards* from that one for the rest of the 80s catalog, except for Crusader, which is still good.
2011's Call to Arms is exceptional, definitely Saxon in top form.
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Yes onwards to backwards....onwards in backwards....backwards onwards? Oh damnit Jim!
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Well I just ordered Power And The Glory and Strong Arm Of The Law. Both were just 7.99€ so pretty cheap!
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Well I just ordered Power And The Glory and Strong Arm Of The Law. Both were just 7.99€ so pretty cheap!
Excellent places to start! Don't forget to get Denim and Leather, if you can find it at a good price.
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I will continue my search for sure!
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Meanwhile, I'm playing the heck out of Hell, Fire and Damnation right now, mixing in stuff from Carpe Diem and Call to Arms, this is a fun adventure. I think I'll get back through more Saxon material today to see where things changed for them.
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I just listened the new one through twice! Man it's a killer!
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Now I'm going back through the older stuff just to make sure and, yes, this is prime quality NWOBHM we got, here. The vocals definitely sound younger in the early 80s, but that's the only difference. Once I finish the review of the early material, I shall do a pass-through of other Saxon albums to find where the commercialism ended and the rocking began anew.
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I just checked and it was not a compilations I had but a two album reissue in one CD case. It is Wheels of Steel and Strong Arm of the Law. I will have to give them a spin!
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I shall do a pass-through of other Saxon albums to find where the commercialism ended and the rocking began anew.
It is the Lord's work you are doing, thank you!
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Going from the 90s end of things, having deemed the mid-late 80s trio of Innocence is No Excuse, Rock the Nations, and Destiny as poor-quality albums.
Solid Ball of Rock... It's got a heavy opening, but is it enough? Sounds like a Def Leppard song, the opening/title track. Not a bad thing in and of itself, but I am looking for Saxon here... Altar of the Gods is more to form with the ripping guitars and proto-thrash drumming. Yeah, I can like this track. But do they keep up the good work? And in the middle of the rocker, some spoken word part that just doesn't go right. Oh well, it gets back to the thrash, so I'm cool with that.
The next track, "Requiem" apparently is pretty well-loved, judging from the comments about how it was played at funerals. That's some respect for the song. As it opens up, I do hear something special and heartfelt in it. It is a ballad, but not for some mortal passing fancy, but for a dear, departed friend. Made me think of our Billy and how I'd love to be sharing a Saxon thread with him, whether he liked 'em or not. Could the song be leftover 80s sentimentality? Perhaps and maybe so, but it is also being put to a good use here in remembering the dead. It's a keeper and whether I like the rest of the album or not, I'll likely get this song because it's really getting me in a good way in a good place.
As the next track starts, it's clear that the band are making their way back to their roots in this release. They're not entirely there, but are honestly and earnestly trying to get back home. But this one and the next are too slow, still too 80s-ish for them to be true classic Saxon. Track number 6, "Baptism of Fire" is a good rocker, better than the previous two, it's almost where it needs to be. There's just something not quite there and I can't specify what it is with this song. It's good and I'll like this along with Requiem and Altar of the Gods, but it's just not grabbing me the way a really good Saxon song does. Maybe it's the echo effects on the vocals, I don't know. Still, I made it to the end without skipping forward, which I can't say for the two previous tracks.
"Ain't Gonna Take It" sounds like a Van Hagar tune as it opens up. Uhhh... not sure about that... But it's definitely reminiscent of "Pound Cake" from Van Hagar. Sadly, it's formulaic and not heavy enough. I think the song itself has good bones and would maybe be better in the hands of Morse-era Deep Purple, but it's just not working for the Yorkshire lads.
"I'm on Fire" is like Def Leppard meets The Rolling Stones. Guessing these guys were blasting out Hysteria as they wrote this album. I think the song works OK, but it's a slower song that belongs between two faster songs. It didn't get that placement in this mix, maybe because the band were coming up short on fast songs. It's reminding me of the Motorhead albums where they were kinda drifting and not hitting on all cylinders that were also coming out around this time.
Next track is sloooooooooooooooooooooooooow, ugh, not what we're looking for, lads... then there's a bass solo that leads into "Crash Dive" that has a nice riff on top of the vibrant bass line. Just wishing the lyrics were about shipbuilding in Glasgow or U-boat crews instead of this being something of a warning to a rival or wayward lover. Yes, I want songs about shipbuilding in Glasgow, given how much I love "Fire and Steel" off their latest album about Colchester steel. This one's not really delivering on the promise of the bass line plus riff. Sad thing...
Not recommending this one. There are a few hits and many misses. It's not there yet, but it's getting back that way.
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Forever Free
Title track/opening track has a great riff to it, but that sound quality is poor. It's close to Power and the Glory in structure and riffing, but lacks the same grab, wondering if it's the sound quality. I need to find a live version, just a sec... yep, the live version from The Eagle Has Landed Part II is way sharper in quality, great track live. So I'll play that one instead and then go back to the studio album, hoping the sound quality issues get fixed on it.
"Hole in the Sky" - still has the audio issues, so the sweet speed on this one is going to face the same uphill battle as Metallica did on their first album. Shame about the production, as this is a strong rocker. Maybe there's a live version of it that's better... no? That's a shame. OK, I'll just put up with the poor mixdown and rate the songs on their Saxon-ness, of which this one and the previous are strong on. Both had a few things not *quite* in the classic mode, but they're both better than the previous album as a whole. I'm good with that.
Next up is a remake of the Willie Dixon classic "I Just Want to Make Love to You." It's like Thunderstruck meets Foghat with ZZ Top, with some odd results. I'm really worried about how the drums sound like the 80s there, that's usually not a good sign. Gonna pass on this one, ultimately. Really need a song about shipbuilding in Glasgow, guys.
"Get Down and Dirty" - PLEASE let this be about coal mining and not a date night! Oh darn, it's not about coal mining... while not as overt as an AC/DC song, it is nevertheless implying a desire for satisfying teenage lusts. Nice riff to it but the drums are still stuck in the 80s. Gonna pass on this one.
"Iron Wheels" - ballad intro, oh dear. Hang on, *this* is the song about coal mining! Did not expect my joke to turn into the next song. Sounds a lot like Bon Jovi, though. A LOT. And then the synth background kicks in... I just can't. Sorry, mates, if you want to be sad and ballad-y about a coal miner in his broken age, let's NOT use Bon Jovi's musical vocabulary.
"One Step Away" is back to proper rocking for the main riff, glad for that. The bridge in the verse goes on too long, though, makes me miss that sweet riffage. C'mon, Saxon! The first two tracks were the best so far, we need something with more oomph to it, we know you got it in you somewhere because it really comes out in future records. Just not here, I guess.
So help me there's so much in this album where the guitar sounds sound like a difference between Eddie Van Halen on OU812 and ZZ Top on Eliminator/Afterburner. It's not the right sound for the band, I think, and having 80s-sounding drums just doesn't do the job. And then there's the Def Leppard thing, which really comes out in the second-to-last song, "Grind." But the last track does rock out pretty good, so it's not all bad news on the album. It's just not got any real hits for me and the muddy sound is really holding things back. With some different choices, things could have been better.
Still not yet in the good albums, I'm afraid.
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Dogs of War
This one's much better than the previous two, but there are still a few songs that give off that mid-late 80s scent of pop-leaning metal. Not going to go into each song, but I'm feeling better about this album than the others I played today, Solid Ball of Rock and Forever Free. It's still not one that makes me want to jump up and GET IT like Call to Arms and Carpe Diem did. I'll finish this one off and then go to the next one, Unleash the Beast.
Unleash the Beast
Graham Oliver out as guitarist and in with Doug Scarratt and wow, there's a difference there! This is a different band from the one trying to find its way - the opening track (including this with the intro) is home for an old metalhead like me. :headbanger: Second track gets an "Aw HELL yes!" from me, we are definitely in a good place with Mr. Scarratt on guitars. I'm not straining to hear signs of things getting better. Solid output and I'm on the third actual song, it's just WOW after the uninspired stuff I spent a few hours plowing through. I'm gonna say the good years begin with Unleash the Beast. There are a few where drummer Nigel Glockler is out due to a pinched nerve in his neck, so I don't know if those hold up. But with this lineup, it's monsters of rock in the making.
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I just checked and it was not a compilations I had but a two album reissue in one CD case. It is Wheels of Steel and Strong Arm of the Law. I will have to give them a spin!
I think I have the same release; it contains 2 CDs and each CD also has bonus tracks, mainly live songs.
Ted
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Sacrifice is growing on me. It's got a different energy from the thrashier albums, but I am liking - no, *loving* - how it's all working out. As bonuses, it's got some re-recordings of earlier material, including Requiem and Forever Free. The version of Crusader with orchestra just came up and it's got a Jethro Tull kind of feel to it that surprisingly works. I like it. The re-do of Requiem is great here, no reason to go back to the 80s original. Wow, it's good. And that re-do of Forever Free is a stomper, yeah! :headbanger: Shows the night-and-day difference between that late era with Anthony Quinn and the current era with Doug Scarratt. And this one is the rocker, no need to reach back to the original.
Also listened to Metalhead, the first of a few albums where Nigel Glockler had to step away from the kit due to a nerve issue in his neck. It's a strong album, not my favorite from this era, but I still see it as a quality album of metalsmithing.
That leaves Killing Ground, Lionheart, The Inner Sanctum, and Into the Labyrinth for me to listen to, and I've already played Jolly Jack Tars/English Man O'War from Lionheart, those are some excellent tunes. Very much looking forward to researching the rest of the era with Doug Scarratt, it's great stuff.
As for the albums stretching from Innocence Is No Excuse up to and including Dogs of War, they're definitely a weaker period for the band. They'll have their fans, the way people will get into Technical Ecstasy or Never Say Die. Nothing wrong with it, but they'll be swimming against the general current that those are poor releases. Starting with Unleash the Beast and going forward, Saxon does a great job with their original material (the Inspirations albums are a different matter, as I discovered to my cost with the second one) and has made some excellent albums from 1997 to today. I think some that I am OK with, others will love much more. Some that I am enthusiastic about, others may be cooler towards. But I think we'd all agree that this is a great body of work that belongs on the same shelf as their classic period albums, covering Wheels of Steel through Crusader.
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I just checked and it was not a compilations I had but a two album reissue in one CD case. It is Wheels of Steel and Strong Arm of the Law. I will have to give them a spin!
I think I have the same release; it contains 2 CDs and each CD also has bonus tracks, mainly live songs.
Ted
Just checking and yes both CDs have 5 or 6 bonus live tracks
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Into the Labyrinth and The Inner Sanctum are both great albums. Killing Ground and Lionheart to go!
Inner Sanctum marked Glockler's return to the drum kit, so Killing Ground and Lionheart will have someone else in that seat. Metalhead didn't suffer for a lack of Nigel Glockler, so I'm figuring those will both be fine.
Then someone gonna make me do a ranking, I just know it... :smug:
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Ah, the run couldn't last forever... Killing Ground is weak overall. Better than the 80s stuff, but it drags along. I'm checking to see how much longer I have on it, and that's when I know I've got an album I might not listen to much ever again. Of the 12 studio albums with original material with Scarratt, one had to be the weakest among them, and Killing Ground is it.
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Thank you for all the analysis! I will take this all into consideration as I move forward with my Saxon collection. I won't be quite as fast obviously as I buy cds but still...bit by bit.
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SO GLAD that I can play them on YouTube first and then make a guided choice in my purchases. :)
Starting on Lionheart today... and then I think I'll go back and play all the ones I bought and have a Saxonathon!
I think I'll also review Heavy Metal Thunder, which looks like it's not a best of, but a re-recording of their early material with the current lineup, I'm interested in that.
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Lionheart is a crusader army of thumbs up. :D Halfway through it, I know this one's a great ride, don't need to hear the rest to get it.
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Going through Power & The Glory right now.
The title track is SUBERB! Watching The Sky is another stand out track. Not fully sold Nightmare or Midas Touch which are bit on the softer side.
EDIT
Holy Moses The Eagle Has Landed is one FANTASTIC tune!
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Yeah, it's an incredible slow burn of a tune, love that one.
For Midas Touch, that was replaced with a re-recorded version of Suzie Hold On in the USA, a faster-rocking tune that I think makes for a better mix of songs.
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Just re-listening to Wheels of Steel and about halfway thru Strong Arm of the Law.... I think I can see why I never continued with them, they're very mixed regarding the quality of song. Wheels has 9 songs, 3 of them are really good, a couple are fine and the rest are generic filler. Side 1 of Strong Arm is generally better but nothing up to the best songs on Wheels.
EDIT: Just finished side 2 and I think it's a stronger album overall than Wheels but doesn't quite hit the highs on Wheels. Essentially 8 songs with no obvious filler, and the best is probably "Dallas 1 PM" which musically is really strong but the lyrics needed to be given to a better lyricist to polish them off... or just re-write completely!
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I'm on Strong Arm Of The Law myself right now and I have to say I'm liking this more than Power & The Glory! Some great riffing on this album!!
Really liking it now!
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Wheels Of Steel is SUBERB I can say that right now!!
I'm only about half way through the album and it's an absolute killer! The title track is a masterpiece!
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Wheels Of Steel was all killer no filler! Great album!
Denim And Leather is bit more of a mixed bag...the over all style is maybe bit softer here. But it still has some good ones too!
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What makes me so happy is that they did find away to get back to their basics with Scarratt on guitar instead of Oliver. Once you've worked through the classics, Unleash the Beast is an excellent album to follow those.
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Glad you enjoy WOS and SAOTL so much, Charger. They are my 2 favourite Saxon albums.
Ted
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Very cool indeed! Those are suberb albums through and through! Been listening to them a lot now! I think Wheels Of Steel is the better one...that is just all killer no filler!
Next I think I'll tackle some of the newer albums... Unleash The Best I saw at a resonable price so might go with that first then Carpe Diem and Thunderbolt!
The title track of Carpe Diem surely is BRILLIANT!
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:yes:
that is one smashing track and I loved that album. Call to Arms is another one to consider, very strong work on that.
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They put out a new video and it's my favourite song too!!
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Inspired by the War thread I just went and ordered 3 new albums!
Call To Arms
The Inner Sanctum
Carpe Diem
All were on sale 13.99€ a pop!
Thank you very much!
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Inspired by the War thread I just went and ordered 3 new albums!
Call To Arms
The Inner Sanctum
Carpe Diem
All were on sale 13.99€ a pop!
Thank you very much!
Yeaaaaaaaaaaah, SAXON!!!! :headbanger:
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I guess you had to hear power and the glory when it was first released as it was such a different sound compared to many of their competitors
I found it to be a breath of fresh air. I also feel that the vocals are very strong on this album
Honestly I'm a fan of most of their records and they have plenty of albums from their past and present that are great and I highly recommend 90% of them
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Power And The Glory is a good album, but from the earlier stuff I do prefer Wheels Of Steel myself.
I do believe that you're right about how it must have sounded back in the day. Saxon sure had a sound of their own. Still do I'd say.
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Just the decade between Crusader and Unleash the Beast is where I'd not recommend a Saxon album. Graham Oliver had become a fifth wheel in that period, and it's night and day between his presence and when he got replaced by Doug Scarratt, who's been phenomenal.
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Well Been listening to the three new additions to my collection...so I think it's time for first impressions.
THE INNER SANCTUM
Good solid album. No bad tracks here, but on the other hand no real stand out tracks either. Atila The Hun is a big epical song but I wouldn't call it a masterpiece though.
State Of Grace is a strange song. There's some Power Metal drumming going on but the guitars just don't really catch up to the fast drumming at all...I'd probably say that's the weakest track on here.
The intro riff to Need For Speed is AWESOME!
CALL TO ARMS
The opener Hammer Of The Gods is SUBERB! Sadly though nothing else on the album can match it. However Mists Of Avalon and Afterburner are great as well! The title track is probably the weakest.
All in all I'd say this is somewhat weaker than The Inner Sanctum
CARPE DIEM
Now here we GO! This is SUBERB! Very close to Hell Fire And Damnation...maybe not quite as suberb but still SUBERB!
No weak tracks here!
The title track, Dambusters, Lady In Gray are probably the top of the crop!
Best of the 3 by quite a margin!
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I would agree with those rankings. Carpe Diem's the top banger in that lot.